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filter?
Aug 13, 2014 16:59:59 GMT -5
Post by ryansweatt2004 on Aug 13, 2014 16:59:59 GMT -5
I think if your looking to trap solids in the water before bacteria can use and convert it, you'd be better off utilizing a couple of micron filter socks. I think these would be way easier and more cost effective way to accomplish what your looking to do. Also, any sand bed whether inside a filter or not should in theory become colonized by denitrifying bacteria. So doesn't this nullify the purpose of what your trying to accomplish?
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Post by jasonandsarah on Aug 13, 2014 17:25:17 GMT -5
I believe it said it uses non tank water to flush? Might be wrong?
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filter?
Aug 13, 2014 18:07:43 GMT -5
Post by Lance on Aug 13, 2014 18:07:43 GMT -5
I said biological filtration removes OR alters.
I would also argue that production of hydrogen sulfide in your tank, while biological in nature (a by-product of sulfate-reducing anaerobic bacteria), it is not part of your filtration. That's called an unintended consequence.
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filter?
Aug 13, 2014 22:25:37 GMT -5
Post by BriMc on Aug 13, 2014 22:25:37 GMT -5
My original opinion of this filter was that it would be a great " Mechanical water polishing filter " but not such a good " Biological " filter.
As for the production of Hydrogen sulfide gas in your tank due to a deep sand bed, I have had my deep sand bed running for 9 years with no issues or Hydrogen sulfide in my tank.
As for a sump with sand and live rock, in my 25 years of reef keeping as well as working with a larger aquarium maintenance company / retail store I have never seen a serviceable sump (with the exception of vacuuming the very top of the sand and blowing off the rock) . Serviceable meaning the likes of a mechanical filter or chemical filter removing media and replacing it with new media.
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filter?
Aug 14, 2014 1:00:50 GMT -5
Post by gotareef on Aug 14, 2014 1:00:50 GMT -5
My original opinion of this filter was that it would be a great " Mechanical water polishing filter " but not such a good " Biological " filter. As for the production of Hydrogen sulfide gas in your tank due to a deep sand bed, I have had my deep sand bed running for 9 years with no issues or Hydrogen sulfide in my tank. As for a sump with sand and live rock, in my 25 years of reef keeping as well as working with a larger aquarium maintenance company / retail store I have never seen a serviceable sump (with the exception of vacuuming the very top of the sand and blowing off the rock) . Serviceable meaning the likes of a mechanical filter or chemical filter removing media and replacing it with new media. for 25years with reef tanks I think your definitions are a little off or your making them up as you go looking at the end of your last post... lmao Serviceable means- capable of being used,cleaned, repaired, etc., EASILY deep sand bed with no hydrogen sulfide? this would mean your deep sand bed isnt working.... have you looked in the plenum? being old school I wouldnt imagine you would have a dsb without a plenum? an experiment for you to try- next time you vacuum the top of the sandbed sink the vacuum down to the bottom of the sand. you will get "black water" this is the hydrogen sulfide ryan- wouldnt some bacteria be good for "left overs" because I dont think 100% of crud will be cleaned out, so there will be some biological benefit and should clean more than the bioballs I think of it like bioballs they are great until they get full of crud and become a nitrate trap. if they were flushed every once in a wile they wouldnt get full and become the nitrate trap everyone hears about.
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filter?
Aug 14, 2014 7:36:00 GMT -5
Post by ryansweatt2004 on Aug 14, 2014 7:36:00 GMT -5
My only concern would be the frequency of having to backwash the filter itself. Considering that most micron filter socks essentially do the same thing and have to be swaped out every three days or so, I can only imagine that a pool style sand filter is going to need to be flushed every few days or so to maintain it's filtering capacity. Especially if your bringing in a constant supply of new livestock that possibly die or shed mucus. It just seems like common knowledge and counter productive to trap solid waste in a mechanical filter in a reef evviroment without immediately removing said solids from the water. Any length of time those solids are left traped, exposed to aquarium water they are being broken down and adding disolved waste back to your water. Same principle as how filter socks and bio balls become nitrate traps right? Obviously I could see this type filter working on a fish only setup where worrying about a buildup of disolved organics in the water between filter flushed wouldn't be an issue but a reef with sensitive corals, I'm doubtful. For what it's worth though, why risk hinging your success or failure on a filter that isn't proven to work in the manner you want it to?
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filter?
Aug 14, 2014 7:39:47 GMT -5
Post by ryansweatt2004 on Aug 14, 2014 7:39:47 GMT -5
By the way, I like your idea of making a pool filter work, believe me, I've thought of it as well but all the logical problems associated with it and the fact that there's many cheaper more effective ways at removing waste materials from a reef tank is what's kept me from perusing it.
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filter?
Aug 14, 2014 9:43:31 GMT -5
Post by BriMc on Aug 14, 2014 9:43:31 GMT -5
Gotareef if you know so much why bother wasting everybody's time posting asking for opinions or posting about something that will get opinions. Yes this is an open forum and that is what an open forum is for but you know it all and when people start commenting you start getting defensive and ridiculing them. Go back on the net and read up on plenums, I have a plenum set up I bought back in the late eighties when they were the latest greatest thing, again another topic you know nothing about. Have you run a plenum? no ? so the best thing you can do is re sight what you read off the web. As for my deep sand bed not working again your lack of knowledge, if my sand bed was not working it would be black and I would not have Terebellids, Nassarius snails, and all the good things that come with a deep sand bed. And as for questioning my time in the hobby, yeah ok.
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Post by jasonandsarah on Aug 14, 2014 9:52:45 GMT -5
Someone has to stop the arguing first?? I mean in the end do either one of you care what the other has on their tank? NO..... let's leave it alone and call it a wash.
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Post by ryansweatt2004 on Aug 14, 2014 9:56:39 GMT -5
I agree, if you can't respect each others opinions and experience, then it's best to keep it between yourselves or to yourselves. Beyond that it's an interesting discussion at least so let's try to keep the personal attacks out of it and keep on the topic of the pros and cons of the filter itself.
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filter?
Aug 14, 2014 12:40:07 GMT -5
Post by gotareef on Aug 14, 2014 12:40:07 GMT -5
BriMc ( Biddeford )- not sure why you think you are the only one thats been in the hobby a wile and not sure why you think your way is the only way that will work but frankly I dont care, this isnt about about you or how you prefer to set up a system, we are trying to discuss a filter (wasting everyones time- re read this topic) getting back to the filter- reading the useful info posted...I agree with this type of filter it would depend on the amount of water being used to flush the sand, which would depend on bioload reaching the filter.... so to many what ifs involved to keep a consistent reliable amount of filtration for the system... now reactor on the other hand ... lol j/k
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filter?
Aug 14, 2014 12:48:52 GMT -5
Post by n00b- Ryan [Poland] on Aug 14, 2014 12:48:52 GMT -5
I know when we flushed ours... it was a pretty good amount of water.... now what if you could somehow return the waste water back into the system and just dump it through some huge ass filter socks..??
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filter?
Aug 14, 2014 12:58:39 GMT -5
Post by gotareef on Aug 14, 2014 12:58:39 GMT -5
if I used dolomite I could flush with freshwater. but I was looking for a way to filter, clean the filter, and do a waterchange at the same time
a micron pool filter would work because you just change the filter cartridge but then we are back to what ryan said about a filter sock...
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filter?
Aug 14, 2014 13:05:49 GMT -5
Post by n00b- Ryan [Poland] on Aug 14, 2014 13:05:49 GMT -5
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Post by jasonandsarah on Aug 14, 2014 13:16:02 GMT -5
There's a ton of people that do automatic water changes with their apex. I'm sure you could translate it to your Rk?
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